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In the program "phoenix persönlich" Theo Koll speaks with Prof. Moritz Schularick, President of the Kiel Institute for the World Economy about the economic crisis, the lack of willingness to take risks, the fear of change among Germans and the consequences of the US election for global trade. "There are two gorillas in the global economy, the USA and China, both of which no longer play by the rules or no longer feel bound by the rules to the same extent as was previously the case and as we had actually agreed," says Moritz Schularick, President of the Kiel Institute for the World Economy. This is causing the "open global economy" to falter. "That means that we have really lost one of the three big, important pillars of the economic success of the Federal Republic - the strong industry, the automobile industry and mechanical engineering - all of which are no longer doing so well against the backdrop of this new global economy. In addition, we have questions about world trade as to what will happen next. We are losing this open global economy. And then we also have to invest a lot more in defense.” The Chinese and the Americans would prefer to negotiate with each European country individually, says Schularick. “Because then China and America are always huge and every single European country is incredibly small.” In order to negotiate on an equal footing and say, “if you subsidize your industries, then that is a violation of the rules and then we have to react to it,” the Europeans have to stand together. “Europe is the resilience area that we also have as a German economy.” With a view to the economic crisis, Schularick demands: “We need a signal of departure, it must also be clear to everyone that we have to take new paths, we have to be much more innovative, we have to become faster, we have to become more entrepreneurial again.” We also have to “roll up our sleeves” in the field of technology. “We are the best in the technology of the last century. We are not the best in the technology of this century.”